Prototype Based Programming in Lisp?

[Kenneth Tilton]

>
> So I generally do all my control from Lisp and issue snippets of JS across
> a network connection to the tools.


That is how I program web apps: send snippets of JS back on each XHR.

With CLJS and Qooxdoo mobile the whole system lives on the client,
simplifying a lot of the coordination I had to do between server and client.

Sounds like you need Cells running in JS managing everything. You just send
over one program that takes care of everything, all in a declarative
modelling paradigm.

Note that your bias (and mine) is that you want to program the devices in
Lisp, not JS. With CLJS you would be programming them in a Lisp.

-kt




On Sun, Jul 3, 2016 at 9:26 PM, David McClain <dbm at refined-audiometrics.com>
wrote:

> An example may help… TheSkyX is a telescope control system for an
> equatorial mount known as a Paramount. This is a high quality telescope
> mount with tracking of stars. It can interface not only to the mount, but
> also to cameras for imaging and autoguiding. But it has limits. An
> autoguider camera mounted on the side of a telescope suffers some degree of
> differential flexure and so the guide camera gradually drifts away from
> where the imaging camera wants to be centered. If left to the autoguider
> control in TheSkyX control program, long exposures would develop streaked
> star images.
>
> So in response to that problem, I have a little “Kicker” program, written
> in Lisp, running alongside TheSkyX, that computes the rate of change in
> differential flexure during the tracking. It prods TheSkyX with changing
> positions as to where it should expect the guide star to be. In effect I’m
> fooling the autoguider into doing the right thing in the face of changing
> differential flexure.
>
> My wider context for control is the location in the sky where I am pointed
> with the imaging camera, and the current time. Javascript does not have a
> concept of saved state, which could allow for differential nudges relative
> to the previous nudge. Instead, I keep that information updated in the Lisp
> executive and offer just the blind differential nudges every minute to
> TheSkyX.
>
> - DM
>
>
> On Jul 3, 2016, at 18:18, David McClain <dbm at refined-audiometrics.com>
> wrote:
>
> Hi Ken,
>
> The Javascript is imposed on me from outside. My tools (TheSkyX and
> PixInsight) are both wedded to Javascript. But that offers essentially no
> executive control — state that must be kept aware of wider context. So I
> generally do all my control from Lisp and issue snippets of JS across a
> network connection to the tools. My Lisp code keeps aware of context and
> state and the JS provides only immediate commands to the tools.
>
> - DM
>
>
> On Jul 3, 2016, at 16:46, Kenneth Tilton <ken at tiltontec.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> On Sun, Jul 3, 2016 at 7:25 PM, David McClain <
> dbm at refined-audiometrics.com> wrote:
>
>> Hi Ken,
>>
>> Not to put too much of a damper on your enthusiasm,
>>
>
> No enthusiasm. As I said, I prefer Common Lisp. You asked if it was a fad,
> I said "No" and provided the indicators I see.
>
>
>> but can you suggest solid technical reasons for migrating from Common
>> Lisp to Clojure? I don’t do web programming.
>>
>
> No, I prefer CL. I was responding to this from you:
>
>  " I’m finding myself being dragged into a “new” world centering on
>> Javascript and prototype based programming. "
>
>
> So I suggested ClojureScript (if you have that option.)
>
>
>> I do machine control, image processing, DSP audio processing,
>> cryptography research, etc. I have never programmed a web page in my life,
>> and probably never will.
>>
>
> So what is the Javascript for? A node.js app of some kind?
>
>
>>
>> My impressions from a few years ago was that Clojure was another language
>> built for the heck of it, much like Python. Not particularly well designed,
>> under the control of one individual, with lots of cheerleading from the
>> small audience. Perhaps it has now matured?
>>
>
> I just started using it three months ago because I am looking for a job,
> so I cannot offer much on growth over the years. I do know a few folks now
> add to the core, and the product is very stable, solid, and mature.
>
> And again, Clojurescript is amazing. Cells is fairly intense and once I
> had it ported to Clojure it took just  a week to get it running on CLJS
> (most of that do to some source code reorg in re macros forced by the
> CLJS->JS compilation chain. So in the context of "OMG! Ihave to do JS" I
> offered my recommendation.
>
> Not that cljs will save you from the prototype model. :)
>
> best, kt
>
>
>
>


-- 
Kenneth Tilton

Lisper/Clojurian for hire

Common Lisp + qooxdoo sample: http://tiltonsalgebra.com
Cells for Clojure/Clojurescript: https://github.com/kennytilton/rube
Clojurescript + qooxdoo mobile JS + Cells: https://github.com/kennytilton/
<https://github.com/kennytilton/rube>qxia
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