From tealeg at member.fsf.org  Wed Dec  3 06:55:49 2008
From: tealeg at member.fsf.org (Geoffrey Teale)
Date: Wed, 3 Dec 2008 07:55:49 +0100
Subject: [munich-lisp] How about meeting in December?
In-Reply-To: <20081119075557.3196.qmail@shadow.splashground.de>
References: <87tzaah220.fsf@freebits.de>
	<18103777c0628a2e3c24a7b6dbb29ce0@fortunaty.net>
	<20081119075557.3196.qmail@shadow.splashground.de>
Message-ID: <15367e850812022255o72acf959n7c9ceb5b9cf93e56@mail.gmail.com>

December 3rd arrives at last.

I am really looking forward to the SLIME talk.

See you all this evening.

-- 
Geoffrey Teale
Freelance Software and Technology Consultant
Munich, Germany
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From bike2ride at gmail.com  Tue Dec  2 05:50:16 2008
From: bike2ride at gmail.com (gL)
Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2008 06:50:16 +0100
Subject: [munich-lisp]  How about meeting in December?
Message-ID: <7ecd7f9a0812012150k3c57f8eeva335f8d1b5a932ce@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Tobias and Munich Lisp Group

I'd love to come to your upcoming meeting and hear about the very
interesting topic. But I'm living to far from Munich ...

If possible please make your knowledge and your guide for best practises
about Slime, the Emacs mode for editing Common Lisp code public.

Thanks in advanced!

Gunnar
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From jimka at rdrop.com  Thu Dec  4 13:43:35 2008
From: jimka at rdrop.com (Jim Newton)
Date: Thu, 4 Dec 2008 14:43:35 +0100
Subject: [munich-lisp] Next Munich Lispers Meeting
Message-ID: <200812041343.mB4DhZnr013841@muvclx14.cadence.com>

Hi everyone, Thanks for attending yesterday's Munich-lispers meeting.
And thanks Tobias for a very insightful and entertaining presentation
about SLIME.   

May I suggest that we have another meeting at the end of January.
I've posted onto the wiki http://wiki.alu.org/Munich
Anyone can update it who wants to.

I've also proposed an agenda.  Several people yesterday said they
might be interested in knowing about how Lisp is used in EDA,
Electronic Design Automation.   I'll be happy to show some of the
interesting features of SKILL (a lisp dialect) which I use at my job.

SKILL, an uncommon lisp

    * Some cool features
    * Similarities and differences from CL
    * Common Lisp-like extensions to SKILL
    * A very opinionated and probably objectionable view of 
              CLOS (I think it should be). 

May I suggest we meet on 27 January at 19h00?  
The same location would be great, if we can reserve the room again.

Anyone in favor? 

-jim

-- 
+------------------------------------------------------------------------+
| Jim E. Newton (jimka at cadence.com)            desk +49-(0)89-4563-1918  |
| Methodology Services Europe                   fax +49-(0)89-4563-1819  |
| Cadence Design Systems GmbH                            Munich Germany  |
|                                                                        |
|           If you won't do it in the rain, you won't do it.             |
+------------------------------------------------------------------------+



From marek at xivilization.net  Thu Dec  4 17:13:17 2008
From: marek at xivilization.net (Marek Kubica)
Date: Thu, 4 Dec 2008 18:13:17 +0100
Subject: [munich-lisp] Next Munich Lispers Meeting
In-Reply-To: <200812041343.mB4DhZnr013841@muvclx14.cadence.com>
References: <200812041343.mB4DhZnr013841@muvclx14.cadence.com>
Message-ID: <20081204181317.4f06daf8@halmanfloyd.lan.local>

Hi,

Yesterdays meeting was great, I'd be happy if we could continue on a
regular, maybe montly basis.

On Thu, 4 Dec 2008 14:43:35 +0100
Jim Newton <jimka at rdrop.com> wrote:

> May I suggest that we have another meeting at the end of January.
> I've posted onto the wiki http://wiki.alu.org/Munich
> Anyone can update it who wants to.

I think reviving the Wiki page is a good idea to show that the group is
still active.

> I'll be happy to show some of the interesting features of SKILL (a
> lisp dialect) which I use at my job.

Great idea, looking forward to it.

> May I suggest we meet on 27 January at 19h00?

Sounds good. Maybe even a bit sooner, because yesterday I had to leave
earlier to catch my S-Bahn.

regards,
Marek



From tealeg at member.fsf.org  Thu Dec  4 17:40:14 2008
From: tealeg at member.fsf.org (Geoffrey Teale)
Date: Thu, 4 Dec 2008 18:40:14 +0100
Subject: [munich-lisp] Next Munich Lispers Meeting
In-Reply-To: <200812041343.mB4DhZnr013841@muvclx14.cadence.com>
References: <200812041343.mB4DhZnr013841@muvclx14.cadence.com>
Message-ID: <15367e850812040940g2752eee9ycd6227b97e02fcb4@mail.gmail.com>

2008/12/4 Jim Newton <jimka at rdrop.com>

> Hi everyone, Thanks for attending yesterday's Munich-lispers meeting.
> And thanks Tobias for a very insightful and entertaining presentation
> about SLIME.


I'll second that.


>
> May I suggest that we have another meeting at the end of January.
> I've posted onto the wiki http://wiki.alu.org/Munich
> Anyone can update it who wants to.
>
> I've also proposed an agenda.  Several people yesterday said they
> might be interested in knowing about how Lisp is used in EDA,
> Electronic Design Automation.   I'll be happy to show some of the
> interesting features of SKILL (a lisp dialect) which I use at my job.
>
> SKILL, an uncommon lisp
>
>    * Some cool features
>    * Similarities and differences from CL
>    * Common Lisp-like extensions to SKILL
>    * A very opinionated and probably objectionable view of
>              CLOS (I think it should be).
>
> May I suggest we meet on 27 January at 19h00?
> The same location would be great, if we can reserve the room again.
>
> Anyone in favor?
>

Definitely.  Well done for taking the initiative.

-- 
Geoffrey Teale
Freelance Software and Technology Consultant
Munich, Germany
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From andy at splashground.de  Thu Dec  4 20:46:37 2008
From: andy at splashground.de (Andreas Hauser)
Date: 4 Dec 2008 21:46:37 +0100
Subject: [munich-lisp] Next Munich Lispers Meeting
In-Reply-To: <200812041343.mB4DhZnr013841@muvclx14.cadence.com>
References: <200812041343.mB4DhZnr013841@muvclx14.cadence.com>
Message-ID: <20081204204637.31034.qmail@shadow.splashground.de>

jimka wrote @ Thu, 4 Dec 2008 14:43:35 +0100:

> I've also proposed an agenda.  Several people yesterday said they
> might be interested in knowing about how Lisp is used in EDA,
> Electronic Design Automation.   I'll be happy to show some of the
> interesting features of SKILL (a lisp dialect) which I use at my job.

That would be great.

> SKILL, an uncommon lisp
> 
>     * Some cool features
>     * Similarities and differences from CL
>     * Common Lisp-like extensions to SKILL
>     * A very opinionated and probably objectionable view of 
>               CLOS (I think it should be). 

A CLOS discussion would be nice to have. I remember some other people
mentioning they've never come around to dive into it. I'm a bit uncertain
about your stance (some native speaker connotaions might have been lost),
are you pro or con CLOS? Can someone else defend the other position?

> May I suggest we meet on 27 January at 19h00?  
> The same location would be great, if we can reserve the room again.

After 18:00 the room is basically always available.

A better room would be easier to get after 7th of February (semester ends
then). Of course the rather warm climate of Z11 (named Takla-Makan) makes
it all more chummy, and I wouldn't want to take that away from anyone.

-- 
Andy



From tcr at freebits.de  Fri Dec  5 23:17:01 2008
From: tcr at freebits.de (Tobias C. Rittweiler)
Date: Sat, 06 Dec 2008 00:17:01 +0100
Subject: [munich-lisp] How about meeting in December?
In-Reply-To: <7ecd7f9a0812012150k3c57f8eeva335f8d1b5a932ce@mail.gmail.com>
	(gL's message of "Tue, 2 Dec 2008 06:50:16 +0100")
References: <7ecd7f9a0812012150k3c57f8eeva335f8d1b5a932ce@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <87vdtymcuq.fsf@freebits.de>

gL <bike2ride at gmail.com> writes:

> Hi Tobias and Munich Lisp Group
>
> I'd love to come to your upcoming meeting and hear about the very
> interesting topic. But I'm living to far from Munich ...
>
> If possible please make your knowledge and your guide for best practises
> about Slime, the Emacs mode for editing Common Lisp code public.
>
> Thanks in advanced!

Thanks to all attendees for the great evening, and all the kind
words. The presentation can be found at

  http://trittweiler.blogspot.com/

I'm looking forward to the next meeting!

Happy Sliming,

  -T.

-- 
Diese Nachricht wurde auf Viren und andere gefaerliche Inhalte untersucht
und ist - aktuelle Virenscanner vorausgesetzt - sauber.
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From jimka at rdrop.com  Wed Dec 10 00:12:13 2008
From: jimka at rdrop.com (Jim Newton)
Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 01:12:13 +0100
Subject: [munich-lisp] Next Munich Lispers Meeting
In-Reply-To: <20081204204637.31034.qmail@shadow.splashground.de>
References: <200812041343.mB4DhZnr013841@muvclx14.cadence.com>
	<20081204204637.31034.qmail@shadow.splashground.de>
Message-ID: <200812100112.13904.jimka@rdrop.com>

On Thursday 04 December 2008 21:46:37 Andreas Hauser wrote:
> jimka wrote @ Thu, 4 Dec 2008 14:43:35 +0100:
> >     * A very opinionated and probably objectionable view of
> >               CLOS (the way I think it should be).
>
> A CLOS discussion would be nice to have. I remember some other people
> mentioning they've never come around to dive into it. I'm a bit uncertain
> about your stance (some native speaker connotaions might have been lost),
> are you pro or con CLOS? Can someone else defend the other position?
>

Yes, i'm basically Pro-clos.  However, i do no know a lot about theoretically
sound object models, and cannot answer questions about CLOS in that
regard.   I look at CLOS as a tool box of lots of capabilities 
that just very often come in extremely handy.  There are, however, some 
design decisions which went into its original design (usually for 
performance reasons) which  I think are unfortunate and others which 
I think are obtuse.

One thing that I think is interesting about CLOS is its ability to do what I 
call Specialization Oriented Programming.  I.e., using CLOS not for
its object model (where classes represent state laden objects with similar
characteristics), but rather using the method dispatch protocol for control  
flow purposes.  In this approach objects of a class do not represent 
entities in any describable sense, but rather they act as policies to 
control which methods are applicable and in which order they 
are evaluated.

I suspect many people will disagree with my opinion.

I look forward to the discussion
-jim



From pc at p-cos.net  Sat Dec 13 13:33:20 2008
From: pc at p-cos.net (Pascal Costanza)
Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 14:33:20 +0100
Subject: [munich-lisp] Next Munich Lispers Meeting
In-Reply-To: <200812100112.13904.jimka@rdrop.com>
References: <200812041343.mB4DhZnr013841@muvclx14.cadence.com>
	<20081204204637.31034.qmail@shadow.splashground.de>
	<200812100112.13904.jimka@rdrop.com>
Message-ID: <96AB05D7-1669-4719-9F24-977743A373FF@p-cos.net>

Thanks for putting me in cc, but since I didn't see the beginning of  
the discussion, I cannot comment on it that well... ;)

Pascal

On 10 Dec 2008, at 01:12, Jim Newton wrote:

> On Thursday 04 December 2008 21:46:37 Andreas Hauser wrote:
>> jimka wrote @ Thu, 4 Dec 2008 14:43:35 +0100:
>>>    * A very opinionated and probably objectionable view of
>>>              CLOS (the way I think it should be).
>>
>> A CLOS discussion would be nice to have. I remember some other people
>> mentioning they've never come around to dive into it. I'm a bit  
>> uncertain
>> about your stance (some native speaker connotaions might have been  
>> lost),
>> are you pro or con CLOS? Can someone else defend the other position?
>>
>
> Yes, i'm basically Pro-clos.  However, i do no know a lot about  
> theoretically
> sound object models, and cannot answer questions about CLOS in that
> regard.   I look at CLOS as a tool box of lots of capabilities
> that just very often come in extremely handy.  There are, however,  
> some
> design decisions which went into its original design (usually for
> performance reasons) which  I think are unfortunate and others which
> I think are obtuse.
>
> One thing that I think is interesting about CLOS is its ability to  
> do what I
> call Specialization Oriented Programming.  I.e., using CLOS not for
> its object model (where classes represent state laden objects with  
> similar
> characteristics), but rather using the method dispatch protocol for  
> control
> flow purposes.  In this approach objects of a class do not represent
> entities in any describable sense, but rather they act as policies to
> control which methods are applicable and in which order they
> are evaluated.
>
> I suspect many people will disagree with my opinion.
>
> I look forward to the discussion
> -jim

-- 
Pascal Costanza, mailto:pc at p-cos.net, http://p-cos.net
Vrije Universiteit Brussel, Programming Technology Lab
Pleinlaan 2, B-1050 Brussel, Belgium











From tcr at freebits.de  Sat Dec 13 14:02:32 2008
From: tcr at freebits.de (Tobias C. Rittweiler)
Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 15:02:32 +0100
Subject: [munich-lisp] Next Munich Lispers Meeting
In-Reply-To: <96AB05D7-1669-4719-9F24-977743A373FF@p-cos.net> (Pascal
	Costanza's message of "Sat, 13 Dec 2008 14:33:20 +0100")
References: <200812041343.mB4DhZnr013841@muvclx14.cadence.com>
	<20081204204637.31034.qmail@shadow.splashground.de>
	<200812100112.13904.jimka@rdrop.com>
	<96AB05D7-1669-4719-9F24-977743A373FF@p-cos.net>
Message-ID: <87ej0cdvgn.fsf@freebits.de>

Pascal Costanza <pc at p-cos.net> writes:

> Thanks for putting me in cc, but since I didn't see the beginning of  
> the discussion, I cannot comment on it that well... ;)

How about giving Munich a visit at the end of january? :-)

  -T.

-- 
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