ASDF debugging on Hangouts?

Tue Dec 26 18:39:34 UTC 2017

Speaking of ASDF, quicklisp loaded :ceramic OK into SBCL on Mac OS X but on
Windows under AllegroCL Ansi I get:

>
Error: OPERATION instances must only be created through MAKE-OPERATION.

[condition type: FORMATTED-SYSTEM-DEFINITION-ERROR]

Is that an ASDF issue? Ceramic? ACL? cffi-grovel (the system being built
when the error is thrown)?

Does quicklisp use its own copy of ASDF for stability?

I will try Clozure on Windows, but I would love to stick to AllegroCL's
windows IDE.

-kt

> 
>
>
On Wed, Dec 20, 2017 at 8:48 PM, Faré <fahree at gmail.com> wrote:

> It looks like there is a bug in ASDF 3.3 worth definitely worth fixing
> before I leave:
> https://bugs.launchpad.net/asdf/+bug/1739514
> Basically, ASDF fails spuriously rebuilds misnamed secondary systems
> and/or things that depend on them, instead of just issuing a warning
> as intended.
> (NB: there are a few hundred misnamed secondary systems in quicklisp.)
>
> That's a good opportunity for another live debugging session some time
> next week.
> One that works this time.
> Please contact me via private email message if you want to be present.
> A public that asks useful questions would be useful.
>
> I expect the total session to last about two to three hours
> from unwrapping the (reproducible) test case to filing the merge request.
> You don't have to attend all of it, and are welcome to leave or join part
> way.
>
> This time, I will record locally so even a remote fiasco like last
> time won't prevent recording;
> however the session will probably be more didactic if there are attendees
> to ask relevant questions about what I'm doing.
>
> —♯ƒ • François-René ÐVB Rideau •Reflection&Cybernethics•
> http://fare.tunes.org
> Multiple instances of a same hacker with different context in his mental
> cache count as multiple hackers wrt documentation and testing needs.
>
>
> On Mon, Dec 4, 2017 at 10:56 PM, Faré <fahree at gmail.com> wrote:
> > My second attempt at a live session was also ultimately a failure:
> > there were interruptions, the rhythm was slow with lots of side issues,
> > the microphone was unplugged at one point, etc.,
> > and it all lasted way too many hours with lots of down time.
> > Happily, none of the two anonymous spectators stayed long anyway, so
> > no one missed much.
> >
> > That said, I battled and vanquished an interesting conundrum of bugs,
> > all of them
> > directly or indirectly related to code upgrade:
> >
> > * Simplest and most obvious issue: ASDF 3.3.1 renamed STAMP< to
> > TIMESTAMP< because the API changed; this caused a naming conflict with
> > LOCAL-TIME:TIMESTAMP<. Solution: in WORKOUT-TIMER's
> > UIOP:DEFINE-PACKAGE, use the :MIX clause with LOCAL-TIME ahead of
> > UIOP, instead of :USE. The backtrace pointed to the correct issue, the
> > ASDF changelog and/or commit messages explained what it was about,
> > this was obvious to find out and fix.
> > https://gitlab.common-lisp.net/frideau/workout-timer/commit/
> 0e3f0104ddb26524f8445ddcf5e34dafe43aa8dd
> >
> > * I had somehow compiled my SBCL with an old script that hadn't set
> > the SB-LINKABLE-RUNTIME feature; but CFFI-TOOLCHAIN failed to tell me,
> > instead failing in a cryptic way. Solution: have CFFI proactively
> > check for feature presence and issue a useful error message if absent.
> > (This is loosely related to SBCL, because CFFI failed to detect that
> > SBCL hadn't been upgraded to be compiled with this recent feature I
> > added.) This issue was compounded by the fact that, while believing
> > that it was an ASDF bug and trying to check at what point the bug
> > appeared, other issues kept cropping up because of the bug below, and
> > the fact that downgrading ASDF is itself quite tricky, unlike
> > upgrading which is trivial.
> > https://github.com/cffi/cffi/pull/127
> >
> > * ASDF stored metadata in the :initform of operation class slots, but
> > then changes due to code upgrade were not visible because the slot was
> > already initialized (yet upgrade previously worked, once, due to
> > change of :allocation to :class). Solution: use defmethod, not slots.
> > This is a deep issue. At root was my failing to take measure of how
> > :initform would ultimately interact with software upgrade, when I
> > originally wrote this code. And yet it worked well enough so far.
> > Fixing the same potential issue with the (more stable but still
> > evolvable) code in the core of ASDF will require applying the same
> > solution to action.lisp all files that define new operations. This
> > will impact backward compatibility and will require yet another round
> > of going through Quicklisp fixing everything (not that many systems
> > define new operations, but some do), and making big announcements. ---
> > Good task for a candidate future maintainer: well defined and
> > predictable, and yet will get you around the core code of ASDF.
> > https://gitlab.common-lisp.net/asdf/asdf/merge_requests/89
> >
> > —♯ƒ • François-René ÐVB Rideau •Reflection&Cybernethics•
> http://fare.tunes.org
> > If you don't like yourself, you *can't* like other people.
> >         — Robert Heinlein, "Time Enough For Love"
> >
> >
> > On Mon, Dec 4, 2017 at 11:29 AM, Faré <fahree at gmail.com> wrote:
> >> Well, after realizing one hour into the debugging session that I
> >> needed to click on a button "Start Broadcast" to go live, I'm going to
> >> reschedule the event, starting at 14:00 EST (19:00 UTC). Sorry.
> >>
> >> —♯ƒ • François-René ÐVB Rideau •Reflection&Cybernethics•
> http://fare.tunes.org
> >> How small of all that human hearts endure
> >> That part which laws or kings can cause or cure! — Samuel Johnson
> >>
> >>
> >> On Wed, Nov 29, 2017 at 7:24 PM, Faré <fahree at gmail.com> wrote:
> >>> After a kernel downgrade, I have painfully managed to get streaming to
> >>> Youtube Live Events working.
> >>> https://www.youtube.com/my_live_events
> >>>
> >>> I'm tentatively scheduled an event at 10:00 EST (15:00 UTC) on next
> >>> Monday December 4th 2017.
> >>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1kq-73Cjn08
> >>>
> >>> I'll be using Hangouts on Air, and will send a message to these lists
> >>> with the link before I go live,
> >>> and also posting the link on my twitter https://twitter.com/Ngnghm
> >>>
> >>> If you have requests for an alternate time slot, I'm open to moving
> the session.
> >>>
> >>> —♯ƒ • François-René ÐVB Rideau •Reflection&Cybernethics•
> http://fare.tunes.org
> >>> What one person receives without working for, another person must work
> for
> >>> without receiving. — Adrian Rogers
>
>

-- 
Kenneth Tilton
http://tiltontec.com/
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